Why don't we just completely abolish the cap then? we'll jsut deal with players using Cash..whoever offers the most cash wins? sounds good right? if we have a signing bonus of 50% the cap should b elike 35 million.. ITs completey stupid to have a 45 million dollar cap and be able to have half of your players contracts not count against the cap..that would be like having a 90 million dollar cap if there were no signing bonuses.

50% is absolutley rediculous..Correct me if im wrong but signing bonuses count against the the Cap in the NHL..there is no reason why it shouldnt here, or else people will just find ways around it.

Futhermore there would be no reason to have a player sign for more than 7.6 million if we actually had correct rules for UFAs and contracts in general...

I see 2 options. 1) either you can offer up to 50% and it does count against the cap. Or it's 20% and it doesnt count against the cap.

If we don't do this, it will just turn into major league baseball and we'll start seeing A-rod type contracts..Someone will offer jagr 6 million+6 million SB because 6 doesnt count...6million off your total profit doesnt even mean that much. Its not real at all.

-- Edited by Sabres at 15:41, 2007-02-19

-- Edited by Sabres at 15:44, 2007-02-19

You're a moron....its 50% of the total contract which you seem to agree with...Hence a 2 year contract of 6 million=12 million+6 million signing for a total for 18 million over 2 years..

Patrice Bergeron -
*3 years - $2,750,000
Signing Bonus $4,000,000*
If that were the case wouldnt bergeron only be aloud to have a signing bonus of 1,375,000....oh right, it's of the total contract....

DUHH you freaking idiot...don't try and belittle me either with your " If you knew any math at all" Please think before you speak...


Secondly, That wasnt he point. The point was 9+4.5 million is horrible for the league and completely unrealistic. SB's need to count OR we need to reduce the SB or else this league will turn into a joke.

If you knew any math at all you would know 50% of 6M is 3M.

Why don't you think about the rules first before you start something. Obviously using words like moron arent words that I find classy, but I guess i get upset when people try and belitte me when its them who don't even have it right. Im sorry if i have offended you.

As far as the 2nd part. I thought it was pretty self explanatory..It's obviously what 50% of 12 million is...

How is 9+ 4.5 completely unrealistic?

Well if this whole league is supposed to be try to imitate the actual NHL. Do you know anyone with that type of contract? Even players like Chara who are worth a very high salery in BRHL because of the ratings he gets, some people think the contract he got in the NHL was too much and that wasnt even near what he'd get in BRHL. In fact ottawa couldnt even come close to resigning them and stay under the cap. Someone would pay him like 10+ here..

If SB's count, all it does is give an unfair advantage to rebuilders which none of us were aware of when the league started.

You mean your friend who just gave 15 million to? In all actuality this helps them MORE. If it does count, top team will be able to continually just hand out huge SB's with their huge profit...However if it doesnt count "rebuilders" will actually be able to sign people without paying 12 million for a player because "top teams" wont have as much room, which is how it actually is in the NHL. Hence boston's signing of chara...

Bergeron's contract is a mistakel

That has no baring on the arguement, it's still over 50% of a 1 year contract which was the point you belittled me on.

-- Edited by Sabres at 16:23, 2007-02-19

You still haven't replied to my argument. The 4.5M signing bonus will just be deducted from the current funds, the important part is the salary that will be on the payroll. What is the difference then between a 9M salary +4.5 bonus and a 9M salary with no bonus (if we were to have bonuses count against the cap then no point in giving them out)?

 There really is no real point except to make people happy in the NHL, so they can get a large chunk of their case and buy their 5 million dollar house. However we're dealing with computers and there is no ratings for player morale.

 

All this 50% does is give teams with cash an advantage by being able to offer them a signing bonus and a longer contract. If signing bonuses counted against the cap, teams would still offer the 9M salary except a bottom feeder with 0$ in cash would get the player instead of a team who managed their revenues well the year before.

 I disagree, people wouldnt offer the 9 because with SB's being counted towards the cap there would be a whole lots less room to sign players then you think. However, if people offer 9 now they can easily just offer up 4.5 of it to the SB and have only 4.5 count towards that cap. That just doesnt make sense. Just look at the real NHL

Sabres wrote:

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All this 50% does is give teams with cash an advantage by being able to offer them a signing bonus and a longer contract. If signing bonuses counted against the cap, teams would still offer the 9M salary except a bottom feeder with 0$ in cash would get the player instead of a team who managed their revenues well the year before.

I disagree, people wouldnt offer the 9 because with SB's being counted towards the cap there would be a whole lots less room to sign players then you think. However, if people offer 9 now they can easily just offer up 4.5 of it to the SB and have only 4.5 count towards that cap. That just doesnt make sense. Just look at the real NHL

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You don't understand my point, I'm talking 9M salary in both cases except one has an extra 4.5M in signing bonus. Most GM's have plenty of cash and the amount GM's will offer in salary won't change whether there are signing bonuses or not, my point the signing bonus will just be on top of that and will advantage teams with cash.

I am not sure how much experience the GMs in this discussion have with the FHL sim, but there are really only a few ways that these things will work.
I generally agree with Philippe that cash will be pointless if signing bonuses or other things you can "buy" apart from the cap are not used.  It is very difficult to fine tune this sim so that some teams will lose money and still have the whole system work under a cap.
To me there are only 3 ways to go and no other options that do actually work with the FHL similator.  I have been working with this sim since it first came out (over 10 years) and it is limited (unless someone wants to put in a ridiculous amount of manual work).
1.  Hard cap, drop finances altogether.  Track salaries, but as long as you are under the $39mill (or whatever the cap for that year is) who cares what else happens finance-wise.  To me, this is what some GMs in this conversation are basically asking for.  I hate it, but I also hate any form of cap because I think it reduces creativity.
2.  Hard cap, cash used outside the cap for signing bonuses, trades, etc.  This seems to be what this league has now, and I don't hate this one.  At least cash has some value.  Rebuilding teams can make a profit and save money for a couple years to make a run at some point.
3.  No cap, finances controlled by the sim.  This is by far the best way to go in my opinion.  I have no idea why so many FHL leagues have followed the NHL with a salary cap.  FHL finances can be set so that the teams that play the best and that have the superstars make the most money (basically a soft cap that can be set so that if a team sells out every game they would make a certain amount of money).  Similar to the system above in that teams can be more creative.  The big difference is that you are not constricted by a hard cap at any point in the season.  You can start with a payroll of $60mill if you want, but you better be in the black by year end.  You can trade for money, trade high paid guys, whatever it takes to get there.  This is the system used in a league I have been in for 10 years, and it works great for us.  I find it allows good teams with good GMs a chance to compete every year if they manage their team properly.  But it also allows bottom feeders to turn things around more quickly, by acquiring youth and draft picks from the rich guys if they desire, or sign free agents in the summer.

I think and Ideal comprimise would make UFA signing bonuses to be aloud to be anywhere from 20-30% of the overall contract, not counting towards the cap. I would rather just have no bonuses but I do think 50% is just crazy, unrealistic, and unfair.

I mean why not make it 100% so people can just sign people with the money they make, and not have it count to the cap at all? I mean why is the line 50%. I hope that's looked at.

Also, if there was a way we could make extra money earned benefit owners in a different way that doesnt compromise the wellfare of the league. Ideas?